Link to Audio Podcast: https://www.bravevoices.fieldscenter.princeton.edu/native-indigenous-voices

Interview with Kimberly Varilek '97

Hosted by Gabby Chavarria ‘26

Gabby Chavarria '26 (00:05)

Thank you so much for agreeing to do this interview with us. So our first question is just your introduction. So it will be name, class year, and concentration. And then you can share your tribal affiliation, your nation or clan, or your tribal community. And if you want to share this in your own Native or Indigenous language, then please do so.

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (00:21)

So I'm Kimberly Varilek. I'm class of ‘97. 1997. And I was an English major, and I also received a certificate in American Studies. I'm an Eastern Shoshone tribal member. I am from the Wind River Reservation in Wyoming. I'm also Ogallala Hongpapa Lakota from South Dakota, from Western South Dakota, along and around Pine Ridge as well. I grew up in the Rocky Mountains and I've lived on the Wind River Reservation when I was younger in elementary school. And then we proceeded down to New Mexico. And so I graduated high school in Santa Fe, New Mexico from Capitol High. And that's where I went from and was living when I went to Princeton.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (01:04)

So our first section is about community and environment. The first question is, how did Princeton's environment compare to the environment you were raised or grew up in? And what was your experience like your first year at Princeton?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (01:15)

So growing up in the Rocky Mountains, it is vastly different from Princeton from being on the East Coast. We have a lot of mountains and plains areas and in New Mexico, it's high desert, so it's mountainous, but also very, very dry. And so when we went to or when I went to Princeton in New Jersey, it's completely a different climate. It was extremely humid, especially in the summertime. So much so that I just couldn't get over that for the first week or so. It was so hot. And so many trees, so green. It's a completely different environment and place to be. So that in and of itself, straight away, was a big difference from anything that I had lived in previously.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (02:01)

So, how did you adjust to the transition at Princeton?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (02:05)

I think it's a great question. I will share that for the most part, I have lived off the reservation and I went to schools that, where I was primarily the only Native student. And that includes high school. In Santa Fe, it was a majority of Hispanic students and Caucasian students or white students. And then some Indigenous students, even though the state in and of itself has a, a tremendous Native population. So going to Princeton, it was not demographically different in that sense. But there were so many different people from all over the world instead of maybe just a local community. Having that shared community experience of a specific place. So that was a lot different. I would say when I moved from Windrever from the reservation down to Laramie. I went to a private elementary school on the University of Wyoming campus. And I think it was at that point where I experienced more of that culture shock. I guess, that kind of issue. It was pretty significant in the sense that I felt very alone. As an Indigenous person, as a Native person going to school for the first time. And that was in third grade. So after that, when I moved on and was able to not only succeed, but develop friendships and all of those types of things, and the school experience really was similar, even though it was public education. Going to Princeton, it was more moving from a public type of a school and academic situation to that private educational system. So that was the significant piece for me. The expectations, the rigor, and it was great, it was challenging. I think that was probably the significant difference versus more of a cultural difference. Even though demographically, you know. Like I said, it was significantly different moving from New Mexico to New Jersey.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (03:56)

So what was your relationship like with your family and your tribal or Indigenous community while you were at Princeton, and did being at Princeton change that?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (04:05)

So, I will share that I did not come from a really affluent family, meaning when I was at Princeton, I was there. I wasn't able to come back home, fly back across the country on a regular basis. And my mom is a public school teacher and an elementary school teacher. My parents have been divorced and my dad was working in, I believe in South Dakota or even Denver. And so, we didn't have the resources for me to just regularly return. So my tie with my community, my local, my family, where I grew up, and even my Indigenous community were pretty much the same in the sense that in, you know, growing up, we would come back home to the reservation Fort Washakie in the summertime to visit family. Sometimes we would get up at other times throughout the year. But it was still that visiting home. And so, even at Princeton in the summertime, we still had the ability when we would come back to Wyoming, it was still visiting home. So visiting family, coming up for our community. We have a pretty big powwow that we have. Come back up and participate and be here and just do different things throughout the years, even like Christmas time and some of those things. But it was always at a point of, I’m not on the reservation, I'm off.

And so coming home even from Princeton was going back to New Mexico, going back to a community where we lived out at this town called Cochiti Lake, which was actually on the Cochiti Pueblo reservation, but it was not the Pueblo. And so, we had friends, I had friends from there. I have relatives who are there. My nieces, their dad, is from Cochiti. And so then my friends were also in Santa Fe and it's still in New Mexico. So that community remained the same. I didn't have a huge dynamic change or disruption just based on the fact that I had been living away from my Indigenous community for a while and coming back, it was pretty much the same. So I don't think it had that much of an effect in the sense of person. But as my experience through Princeton and being at Princeton, longer I was there and the information, not only the learning, the academics, but experiencing and building community at Princeton, it did help change. I think it helped change my view of who I was in relationship to my friends, you know, what what was kind of going on, the dynamics of the community in and of itself. It's pretty extraordinary, I think, to be a Native person and then end up living with another Indigenous community. I'm not from that community, I really had a strong sense of friendship and even cultural tie. We would experience and participate in some of their cultural activities. So I felt that we were able to keep those connections and continue to build them and appreciate them.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (06:54)

That was great. Were there any moments when your identity as Native or Indigenous made you feel marginalized from the greater Princeton community? And if so, could you describe this moment?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (07:05)

Yeah that's a great question. I was trying to reflect. I think, again, my academic experience and life experience preceding Princeton, where I was really one of few Indigenous people at a school at any given time, that didn't change for me. I felt that Princeton was big. There were so many people from all over the place that there wasn't any sort of singular identity. And so everybody was representing themselves maybe in a capacity where you don't have a lot of you around, if that makes sense. But I will say, and I know that this is a beloved institution, it was beloved to me as well, but when I participated in the Native Americans at Princeton, I was participating immediately in leadership. I think I was the vice president and then a couple of years later, I was the president of our community organization. And we had this great support place and it was a place very, very beloved from a bunch of students, people of color from Princeton. But I remember going there the first time and it was the Third World Center. And I was like, why are we as Indigenous students, why is this our place, Third World? And at that time, I think I felt sort of displaced or marginalized, if you will, in terms of what is being Native at Princeton. I can tell you that the people were phenomenal and soon it was just a place. It wasn't a place or a term and it wasn't, I don't think, I don't even know if it was even acknowledged in that regard by the university. But I would say that that was probably one of the first times I felt that, that is really interesting how we would treat our Indigenous students from this country, from a first world, supposedly.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (08:48)

Yeah, it's very interesting because it has been renamed so many times, but I wonder like, what is your perspective on, does that renaming change the space or does it kind of feel the same?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (08:59)

You know, it's been a long time since I've had the chance to be there. Name is important. I think name, it helps people to not feel displaced, if you will, or marginalized. I don't know the various iterations, but really, you know, while I say name is important, it's really about the people. It's really about the community there. And to that regard, I don't think anything has changed in the sense of warmth or welcoming, inclusivity. Those are all very important things. Now, again, I haven't visited in quite a while. And from my understanding, there's new space or new areas as well on campus, and I would love to visit them to get more perspective. But I think, you know, once I kind of got over that just initial shock or maybe just sort of that, that reality, the resources, the people, and the ability to just go to a place if you needed, that was really great. So I like the fact that names, it is important that we consider that naming, but it's really about building the support at the place that's even more important.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (10:03)

Thank you. So we'll be moving to identity as our next section. Did being at Princeton change the way you perceive yourself as Native or Indigenous?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (10:12)

No. And I say that because, I mean, it just affirmed more to me being away from home that, you know, was I prepared to be in a space, a place away from my family and be me and represent me and my family and culture? And I felt I was able to do that pretty successfully. So I don't feel like it changed necessarily who I was. I had a lot of learning to do, even meeting groups with other Indigenous students, other Native students who, you know, we're not a homogenous group. We all come from different parts of the country. We all have different cultural backgrounds. And at that time I had really not experienced meeting or being around or hearing and engaging Indigenous students or Native students, not from the Rocky Mountain area. I was familiar with Pueblo culture. I'm familiar with Plains culture. You know, my tribes, how how we work together, how socialize and, you know different things that we have in our community. I think it really started to build an understanding for me that my Indigenous experience and the experience from my family, how that was just important and rich in the sense of the Indigenous experience or Native experience across the United States. And I say that in a way of the different kinds of policies from the United States that affected families. How the different places and different histories and different cultural aspects of different tribes and how they've survived, if you will, how we have survived.

How those experiences are extremely different and really create different narratives or different identities that are just as Native and I will share an example. I sort of got into, not a confrontation, but I was very close with some of my classmates and we were talking about something and we started to kind of get into an exchange about you know, what is a Native person? Who, you know, what is your family? Who are you? And their criticism of me, I don't speak my Native language, but that was also intentional from my great grandparents era. Language and an ability to speak language and how did that make you more or less of an Indigenous person in the US? And it really hit home for me that that's not a measure. In fact,

my communities have been very impacted by Western culture, if you will. Expansion, the relationships between the federal government and the tribal government, and the experience in Plains tribes and how that differed from other tribes. And then I think I really started to grow and appreciate how impacted other community members were. So I, for example, I’m an enrolled tribal member from the Eastern Shoshone tribe. There are tribes and representatives and friends of mine, close friends of mine from Princeton who do not have that shared experience. They're still working, their tribes and communities are working for federal recognition or they’re state recognized. And started to understand, I think it was more of a personal growth point. And ultimately now in my professional world, I certainly appreciated a lot more. But I really began to understand that that experience is just as Native or Indigenous and significant to the United States and the experience that you're bringing forward. There is no defined vision or image of an Indigenous person or Native person from the Americas here. We all have and bring our own history or, you know, we're survivors, if you will, and representatives of our communities and that has to be respected. You know, it's not just one unilateral experience from Eastern expansion to the West, if you will, or from the East to the West and how that engagement has happened. So I really feel like if I were to say it changed me, it helped awaken my understanding of a broader Native experience in the United States. Something beyond myself, I guess.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (14:22)

Yeah, I think I'm also, doing this project has really given me so many different perspectives of what it means to be Native and Indigenous. So, I relate to that.

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (14:31)

Good. Very good.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (14:33)

So the next question is, how did you balance your sense of belonging to your Native or Indigenous identity and community within the broader context of Princeton's social and cultural life?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (14:44)

So again, I think with my previous, you know, going to school, having friends from all sorts of different backgrounds, that was very similar. And I, you know, got to know people from my Outdoor Action experience straight away as a freshman through my roommates, through our hall. And it was really fun. I had a great time meeting people and learning more about them. And I was really excited to see where people were coming from. And then as I grew, I guess, or as we mature and as you go through school, I was in a suite with friends. And so again, the broader experience of learning about other people and being one of those folks who they're learning about, it didn't seem out of character necessarily for me or change who I was or my relationship and my understanding of who I am and my relationship with my family, my community. I also had the, and I mentioned this before, we were a part of the Native Americans at Princeton. We were calling it N-A-A-P just because I knew we didn't want to, we were at Princeton, but anyway.

Straight away, even before I came to Princeton, when I came out to visit, I was hosted by Tina Pierce, who's a class of '94. And, you know, she was a senior at that time, but she was also part of the Native organization on campus. And so, I thought, great. We have a, we have a community, we have some people here, we have an organization for people who do identify as Native or want to participate in this type of, you know, just whether it's social or academic, you know, that we have this and it's within the experience of Princeton and the broader university. So when I came in, I think, you know, socializing, I was getting to know people, I had that great Outdoor Action experience. Found camaraderie and classes, friends, you know, roommates. We got to know each other. My roommate from my freshman year's from South Carolina, we're still good friends and we lived together our sophomore year when we were still in, we were in the Butler college that I don't think exists anymore. But it was, it was great. So we all kind of had that shared, living situation and it was, it was fun. It was, it was really fun. And then I also to know Native students across the campus. And I also was on the golf team. So we, you know, I kind of did that straight away. I played golf in high school and called the coach up. I didn't know anything about recruiting or anything. I was not at that caliber of sport or athlete, but because Princeton the golf team for women was relatively small. They were very welcoming and wanted everybody to come and participate. And so I grew along with the team as well. So I had a number of different social outlets that I was really excited and was able to access. And I didn't feel that my Indigenous experience was somehow limited or that I had to put it away in some sort of way. Because we were all from all over, including international students. One of our roommates was from England or UK. So were from all over the place. And so I think that feeling of we were not all from the same area, we were not all from the same background, just led to maybe an easier transition of finding community, both Indigenous non-Indigenous community.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (18:04)

That's very cool. I didn't realize we had a women's golf team until now.

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (18:08)

Yeah. Yeah. Like there's so many, like, I think there were 50 men who would come out and try out for golf, every year and the team is about 10 to 12 depending. And for the women, we might have had eight people. So we were, you came out, you were on the team, which was great, which I loved it. It was, it was amazing.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (18:33)

So our next section is about administration. If there was one change that the Princeton leadership could make to improve experiences for Native and Indigenous students on campus, what would that be?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (18:43)

So, you know, again, my experience was very, I think it's a place and time with Princeton. I do think it had improved even previously. You when we look at, I think it was 1970s, late 60s, 70s, when Princeton really opened their doors to women even and people of color and Indigenous students. I do want to make a quick caveat that there has been Native presence at Princeton and I understand that. I think piece of, and I don't think this was an institutional intention from the administration, but we had faculty who were very dedicated and very interested. Alfred Bush, I don't think I could say, or anybody from the last 50 years of Princeton could say that their experience or however long Alfred was there, that their experience didn't include some type of tie with the Western Americana exhibit in the library. And namely, Alfred. He was somewhat of an institution for us based on his own personal experiences and such. So when I look at the administration and I look at things that have evolved where Native students have been at Princeton since its inception, really. The local tribes and educating students before even the United States became the United States. I think that there needs to be more of a celebrated tie and recognition. I think that's probably one of the few things that while it's there, while it's part of the history, it's something that isn't touted. It's that relationship is sort of well, that's a story of Princeton. It's not a celebrated element necessarily. And I could be wrong. Maybe that's changed. But I think another piece that the administration could change or work on is developing better support for Indigenous students or Native students at Princeton.

I think I was somewhat fortunate because, like I said, my experience growing up as a child and having an early culture shock sort of prepared me for not being around people who look like me, who are from my home or from my cultural background. And I was able to focus, I think, on academics. I was able to focus on learning and building friendships and participating in things. And I think when we look at students from different parts of the United States, if you don't have that type of background, if you haven't already gone through something like that in your life, you could struggle and that's any student, right? But specifically for I think Native students, not seeing yourself in a place in general is hard. And you definitely get as a person, you get lonesome, you get homesick and it becomes much more of an uphill battle when you start feeling more isolated than being in a community. So I think the administration could help by providing additional support, student support specifically. And maybe it's for each community or each populace that we have at Princeton, but specifically having a mentor or having somebody who can help Indigenous students. There's not many. And that's the other thing I think the administration can help focus on is external recruiting. There are so many talented Native students in this country that it's hard for me to see that not even 3% of the Princeton student body is Native.

And I will share with you, and I think I've shared this previously in other discussions and topics, but you know, as the president or vice president of Native Americans at Princeton while I was there, we would get a list from the enrollment and, admissions office, excuse me. And they would tell us, well, here's the students who identified as Native in their application. So new students, we would call them and we would welcome them. And I will share that a good three to four of maybe a list of 20, maybe 25% of that. They would be like, I don't know what you're talking about. I didn't check any box. I don't know why I'm, you're saying I'm being identified as Native. I'm not Native. So that straight away took out a portion of who is, in terms of building community or trying to be that community for others without that administration support. I were generous, I shouldn't say generous, they were definitely willing to partner with us to help identify people and build space for Native Americans at Princeton, to provide a budget. You know, those types of things as a social point or other, but I think there could be more. And now I understand there's an international or an Indigenous Center. Maybe that's renamed, maybe it's the same kind of space. There's also a Native or Indigenous faculty member, specifically a chair, which I think is fantastic.

We don't want to marginalize Native American experiences, Native American, Alaska Natives, and Native Hawaiians with a broader Indigenous perspective because then it's so global. But there is a unique relationship. I think that Princeton could really lean into that. It's a political relationship. And I think that there's just so much opportunity to really build out and be proud of the ties even before Princeton became an open institution to everybody, if you will. There were still ties to the Indigenous relationships and how that worked. So I think being proud of that would be very helpful in a school where you go and you're, I think one of your questions was, did I see myself at Princeton? No. I was the representation. I'm the Shoshone, I'm the Makota.

You know, I was there. I was there, therefore I was the present representation at the school. And I was able to do that. Not many students I hope are successful in doing that, being able to represent their communities and understand that. But that's more grassroots built or student built, then maybe driven or recognized by the administration.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (24:41)

Yeah, a lot of people have been discussing the more representative aspects of it and how they feel like they are the only representation that they see. But it's really interesting to hear your perspective on the administrative parts of it, like recruitment and things. There have also been some talks about the academic advancements because a Native and Indigenous Studies minor has just been announced by the Effron Center. So yeah, we've been getting a lot of different perspectives on the different areas that need improvement.

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (25:08)

I mean, there's always improvement. And if you're willing to listen and willing to understand, think that would be great. You know, we even as part of the Native Americans at Princeton, we were able to also put on a self-study seminar looking at Native studies and what that looked like. And it was definitely interesting. It was open to all students. So we had some students, non-Native students participate and they were both, I think, intrigued as well as amazed that there were Native students at Princeton, but they jumped right in. They were definitely interested and willing to come and be part of the group. And I thought it was really interesting. And I think having that opportunity where...And I'll share with this, even through my experience, I also feel people who are not Native feel intimidated about asking or, you know, they don't have a background in Indigenous communities. Maybe in my professional growth, I'm an Indian law focused attorney. I now work in the Tribal Affairs Branch for the federal government. But I feel people are scared to ask.

They're scared to ask questions. They feel uncomfortable asking or knowing because they didn't grow up in a community right next to a reservation, most likely. But if they did, then great. But if they didn't, which is, think, a majority of Princeton students, there's not a sense of, well, not only is it about Native students integrating into the Princeton community, it's about providing opportunity for other students to learn about Indigenous issues, Native issues, know that there are Native people who currently exist in a common and current form, and what that looks like. What does that relationship look like? So I think that there's a lot of opportunity to also enhance that experience to the broader Princeton community.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (26:59)

So our next section is campus life. What was the campus climate like for you during your time at Princeton?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (27:05)

Again, I think it was more social focused versus issue based or, you know, we didn't see a lot of at that time from my recollection. This is, you know, pre 9/11 where we were really just kind of living our lives. There was no major social action happening that was facing campus that really, that was so big and so prominent that it took everybody's attention or really brought everybody's attention. So it was really about navigating your daily life and trying to do your academic work and also be at home. Be at home with yourself and be at home with your roomates, your friends, teammates, and everyone. So I feel that campus life in and of itself was very, sort of wide open. There wasn't any sort of polarization issue happening. You could participate in any almost, any sort of way that you wanted to. You know, The Street is always a big, big element of social life and campus life.

But opportunities, things that were built out in, I think, freshman and sophomore year, traveling, doing experiences, going to New York, doing those kind of things and having your class do different things. I thought it was really, I don't know that it could have been more or less at that point. Again, this is a number of years ago, trying to remember, but I... I don't remember feeling or having any sort of glaring external issue. And so we really were our own little enclave and existing within that enclave and able to experience the world in that regard.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (28:37)

So do you see any changes in Native and Indigenous representation at Princeton now in comparison to when you were a student?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (28:45)

I think it evolves and it kind of changes and morphs in different ways. It's still relatively a small footprint in terms of student life, but also alumni. I feel like, you know, as the years go on, the more Native alumni grow, you know, more and more Native alumni will be there. I have seen just recently with Yolandra, who is one of the trustees for Princeton. She, I think, was able to help really bring and reframe some of the priority points for the Princeton community to the forefront and really help to that point where there isn't a chair now and hopefully, it sounds like there's going to be an Indigenous Studies path for academic study. That's great. So I do think there is evolution compared to the stories or kind of hearing at the time, if you think of Indigenous students or Native students being on campus in the late 60s, early 70s, that was a very specific time in American history. And really, we look at the AIM movement, we look at those types of issues, social issues, civil rights issues that were happening and where Native people fit in those places in that time, that was a dynamic. And I felt that we had at least grown into a point of better acceptance, better understanding. I feel that we're continuing to build on that. The vernacular that we use, the expectations that we use now for students, I think it continues to grow. But we have to be, we still have to be, attentive of it. It just isn't something that's naturally occurring. And so it does need to continue to be cultivated, I do feel that is a different way now, maybe that we're working with our Indigenous Native students. I haven't had the chance to really dig in and I've met some of the Native students through some of the alumni associations and trying to build presentations. But I haven't had the opportunity to really engage directly. And I would love to see us strengthen those ties. But as far as how we continue to work, I hope that gaining experience of having a rich culture of Princeton students and having diversity, you people think that's such a bad word. It's not. It's a great word and being inclusive, including communities. I think we can continue to do more. There's more opportunity. There's more understanding now. So I'm hoping that we, hope that we will continue to build off of that. I hope that that's helpful. It just seems to be some different iterations across time and yeah.

Gabby Chavarria '26 (31:13)

That was great. So our final question is, what is your advice for current students and what is your hope for future Native and Indigenous students on Princeton's campus?

Kimberly D. Varilek '97 (31:24)

That's a great question. I really, I really appreciated that. For current students, and I've dealt, I've worked with and mentored some other people, not necessarily at Princeton, but students who went to elite institutions, have familiarity. And the first thing, it's always community, right? We're always kind of looking to build and connect with people who understand us and who know us. But at the same time, my advice to current students is be the best you. Don't worry about being the best Native. You are Native. You are Indigenous. That's who you are. So be the best you. Take advantage of your opportunities. Don't worry about trying to fill the space of representation. By being there, by being vocal, by being present, you are representing your community and continue to understand that. And that's something I think that my great grandmother, she told that to my mom and my mom told me, that you're going to go through life as an Indigenous student or Native person and you're going to be the first Native person that they ever meet. And so having that understanding, I think, and hopefully for, for current students and future students, you may be the first Native person that somebody ever meets. So be the best you. Don't try to represent everybody. That's too big. That's, know, you don't have to be the most Native. You don't have to speak your language and have all of these cultural ceremonies to other people. Be you. Know who you are. And I hope that that's encouraging and helpful for students now.